A special House committee on Monday morning couldn’t reach a decision on whether to dismiss a complaint that Democratic state Rep. Ford Carr lodged against Republican state Rep. Nick Hoheisel over an incident on the House floor.
The committee deadlocked on a 3-3 vote with Republicans believing the complaint should be dismissed because each of the Wichita lawmakers had a hand in the exchange that led to the House shutting down debate for about two hours on Feb. 20.
Democrats, meanwhile, said Hoheisel should be held accountable for profane remarks directed at Carr and urged the committee to send a message about that type of conduct in the Kansas House.
The committee adjourned. The complaint is not dismissed. It is up to the committee chair whether to reconvene the committee. He said the committee would not meet again on the Carr complaint against Hoheisel.
The select committee may dismiss the complaint or may make recommendations to the full House of Representatives for reprimand, censure or expulsion. In five similar types of complaints dating to 1951, none of those actions have been taken.
“As I’ve said before, I believe that Rep. Hoheisel was one cause for the disruption or disturbance, however, he was not only cause,” said Republican state Rep. Bob Lewis of Garden City and chair of the special House committee.
Carr filed a complaint against Hoheisel for yelling “bullshit” at him on the House floor following race-related remarks that the Democrat had made at the podium on Feb. 20 while the chamber debated a gun-education bill.
Carr alleged that Hoheisel violated a rule in Mason’s Manual of Legislative Procedure that says no person shall use profane language that disrupts the orderly proceedings of a legislative body.
Carr told the committee he felt “severely threatened” by Hoheisel that day, accusing the Republican of putting a finger in his face while using the word “bullshit.”
Hoheisel said his comment was in response to a remark that Carr made about 15 minutes earlier when questioning another GOP lawmaker at the podium on the gun bill.
“It’s good to see that there are some members of the Republican Party that are either not racist enough that they don’t mind coming to answer my questions or not so fearful that they wouldn’t either,” Carr told Republican state Rep. Bill Rhiley.
About 15 minutes later, Hoheisel approached Carr on the House floor – after meeting with another Democratic lawmaker seated nearby – and called the remark “bullshit.”
Hoheisel said Carr told him, “If you have a problem with it, meet me outside in 10 minutes.”
What Carr meant had been a focus of the committee’s deliberations.
Carr said he wanted to step outside the House chamber to talk over their differences, a point that was viewed skeptically by some members of the committee.
Some members of the committee said they believed Carr was trying to pick a fight in his response to Hoheisel’s “bullshit” comment.
Lewis said he didn’t believe that Carr’s representation of “meet me outside” was credible. He said those words are generally regarded as a challenge to a fight.
He also said there was an inconsistency between a statement Carr made to the Capitol Police the day after the incident and his complaint filed with the House several days letter.
Lewis said Carr omitted a reference to “meet me outside” in his complaint to the House, something that was included in the report to authorities.
He said the inconsistency caused him to question Carr’s claim that inviting Hoheisel to meet him outside was a benign request to settle their differences.
Lewis said Carr contributed to the incident in two ways: His race-related comments at the podium and what appeared to be a challenge to a fight outside the chamber.
“Rep. Hoheisel appropriately refused the invitation to fight, which tended to de-escalate the situation, and I find it significant and helpful that he has since apologized to the House for the disruption he helped cause,” Lewis said.
“I have heard no such apology from Rep. Carr for his contribution to the disruption.”
Democratic state Rep. Barbara Ballard of Lawrence said that to dismiss the complaint was to essentially ignore that the altercation even occurred.
“I think we need to send a message that this kind of behavior…is unacceptable in the House,” Ballard said.
“I think there should be a reprimand of some type,” Ballard said.
“To dismiss is to say it didn’t matter,” she said. “I feel it did matter because a lot of people got involved in it and they witnessed it.”
Democratic state Rep. Mike Amyx of Lawrence also said it would be wrong to dismiss the complaint outright, especially since Carr felt threatened.
“I believe an action is warranted,” Amyx said. “I think there was an action here that was taken that caused a disruption to the floor and the proceedings of the day.
“I think we have the responsibility of some action other than dismissal to be taken here.
“There’s got to be something there that says this event happened and we will not tolerate it. I cannot vote for a dismissal,” he said.
Democratic state Rep. Dan Osman of Overland Park said Carr’s race-related comment at the podium should not factor into the committee’s deliberations.
Osman said the committee should focus on the subject of Carr’s complaint, rather than what he said minutes earlier.
“If we focus specifically on the altercation itself, that is an ongoing process in the question of whether that was disruptive to the debate as a whole and I think we can make the argument that it was,” he said.
Lewis said he agreed that the manner in which Hoheisel raised the issue with Carr was “inappropriate” and led, at least in part, to the disruption in the House that day.
He believed that Carr’s earlier comments were relevant to the committee’s consideration of the complaint.
“I do think it’s appropriate for us to look at the entire situation and think of it in terms of did Rep. Carr – the complainant in this case – contribute to the disruption that he’s alleging Rep. Hoheisel caused,” Lewis said.
